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« United States Naval Nuclear Power School | An Inside Look - Part I | Main | Various Topics » Nuclear Nightmare, Learning XHTML/CSS, Trying to Quit Coffee, Dog to Wed in Prague »

U.S. Naval Nuclear Power School | An Inside Look - Part II

Officers & the Nuclear Culture

United States nuclear-powered ballistic-missile submarine

This entry continued from » Part I

Far from being coddled, Nuclear officers were taken to task and held responsible.

Do you recall the fiasco at Abu Ghraib prison? .. the one where the officers in charge claimed ignorance? before fingering the enlisted folk? That would've never happened under Rickover's watch. He would've had their officer nuts hanging in his office by sunset.

Nobody told Rickover, "Sir, I uh, didn't know that was going on ..." .. uh, not if they wanted to keep their jobs. In Rickover's Navy, not knowing about something (ignorance) is *worse* than condoning it.

Not a single one of them had the balls to stand up and say, "That prison was my responsibility." Every one pointed the finger and claimed ignorance. Zero accountability.

If you research the case of the nuclear submarine that ran aground, you'll find they were given bad maps (said so in the 60 Minutes interview) .. which didn't include the underwater mountain. The Captain *still* took responsibility .. claiming he should've verified the maps .. by checking them against other sources.

How's *that* for a contrast with what we've seen from officers (in the news) from other military services? (But I digress. That stuff frosts my @ss, as you can probably tell.)

••••• today's entry continues below •••••

Rickover's Influence

Mistakes in the nuclear Navy were not tolerated (.. which is probably why incompetence bothers me so much). Excuses were a luxury none of us could afford.

Under the heading labeled "Controversy," the Wikipedia entry for Rickover says the following:

Hyperactive, political, blunt, confrontational, insulting, flamboyant, and an unexcelled workaholic who was always demanding of others – without regard for rank or position – as well as himself, Admiral Rickover was a thundering force of nature and lightning rod for controversy.

Moreover, he had "little tolerance for mediocrity, none for stupidity." "If a man is dumb," said a Chicago friend, "Rickover thinks he ought to be dead."

This is the guy who started and ran the Navy's nuclear propulsion program. Like I said, excuses were a luxury none of us could afford. We did our jobs and did them well. (Or we were replaced.) But as I said, the training program spared no expense.

Many books have been written about Rickover. His retirement party was attended by all living U.S. Presidents. (He served under 13 different POTUS's.)

Everything Else Easy By Comparison

Since being discharged (honorably, of course), I found everything that has followed to be comparatively easy. No matter what challenges life may bring, I feel confident facing them, knowing I've faced more difficult circumstances in the past (thanks to Rickover and his demanding program).

On my Discharge papers (DD-214), the nuclear program in which I served is described as » arduous (the Navy's own description). I didn't know what the word meant. Had to look it up. Here's what I found »

  1. difficult and tiring: requiring hard work or continuous physical effort
  2. steep or demanding: very difficult to traverse, endure, or overcome

The program is great for people who enjoy challenging themselves. Yet I've never recommended it .. to anyone. There are much easier ways to make a living.

For Masochists Only 

Now that I'm done, I'm happy I went thru it, and that I was able to survive. But I'd never do it again, not knowing what I know now. Much as I dig technology, and a good challenge, the Navy's nuclear program is for masochists only. Certainly not designed for fun.

But it has made me who I am. Maybe now you can understand why I enjoy the Bourne series so much. A guy is surprised by the things he knows and what he's able to do. And it's all due to some clandestine goverment program. You think I might be able to relate? (Can't wait for the Bourne Ultimatum to be released later this week.)

You *do* however, work with top-notch people in the nuclear program. (Won't find many dimwits running reactors.)

Elitists

One last point » Some nuclear-trained people (that I worked with) could be considered elitists. In other words, they didn't associate with (looked down on) anyone 'cept other "nukes".

The Dog and I (especially the Dog) were the first to make friends with those outside our department (Engineering), and were actually ostracized by some senior clique-ish types for this. The Dog however, was never the type to care much about what others thought.

The Dog 

Of all the people I met in the military (over the course of my 6-year enlistment), there's only one I still stay in touch with » the Dog. He lives in NYC. (Cuz he feels most comfortable in urban environments.)

BTW » In a few days the Dog will be leaving for Prague .. where he'll be married (for the first time) .. to a girl from the Czech Republic, who he met in NYC. (She's much younger than the Dog .. ~20 years younger.)

If anybody deserves to be happy in a relationship, it's the Dog. He's such a great guy (with some issues, which he readily admits). From what I hear, she is better at making relationships work than the Dog. They've been together ~3 years.

I received an invitation to the wedding, but can't afford to go. The Dog understands. Heard Prague was beautiful .. not destroyed by WWII the way many other European cities were.

Dr. Wolf 

Of all the instructors I had at NPS, my favorite was Dr. Wolf. He was from Brooklyn, or the Bronx (.. one of those New York boroughs that begins with a 'B').

He taugh Math. (Believe his doctorate was from NYU.) Not very tall. Full salt-n-pepper beard, well trimmed. Oozed cool. Very charismatic. Not very military. Spoke with a distinct NY accent. Obviously knew his stuff. Very comfortable with the subject material. Enjoyed teaching. Made learning fun.

Near the end of some class (each 50 or 55 minutes long) .. he'd check his watch and say, "Put your books away. You don't have to know this." .. and continued teaching .. sometimes straight thru the break. Nobody left.

He'd usually share some wild, cutting-edge Physics .. that made our heads spin with theory. Serious "Whoa!" factor.

I liked Dr. Wolf cuz, where I grew up (and went to school) intelligence was never considered very cool. The coolest kids were usually not the brightest. I even had some kids wanting to kick my butt for reasons related to academics. So intelligence there could be considered a negative (something to hide).

Final Points

On a nuclear sub which carries ballistic missiles (the presence of which I can "neither confirm nor deny") the sailors who operate and maintain the reactor plant have nothing to do with the missiles.

Two different jobs. Handled by two different departments. In other words, nukes aren't experts on missiles.

In all the documentaries I've watched on nuclear submarines, I've never yet seen one where they take you back into the engineering spaces.

They simply show you the door, and say (voiceover), "Back there are the engineering spaces, where the reactor lives. For security reasons, we weren't allowed to film back there."

With that said, your average run-of-the-mill ballistic missile submarine carries more firepower than all the bombs dropped in all the wars since the beginning of time .. immemorial. (This is where a submarine sailor usually stands and salutes.)

Comparison with Non-Military Schools 

If I had to select one word to describe the Navy's nuclear program .. here it is » grueling. Now, is it (as the Wikipedia entry states) "one of the most difficult academic programs in the world"? Maybe so. Maybe so. But then, I have little to compare with.

For example, I never been to MIT, Hardvard Law, Wharton or Yale (like my brother). Are these schools difficult academically, or just difficult to get into?

The Dog went to Columbia (an Ivy League school) after getting out of the Navy .. said he held his own (in their Civil Engineeering program).

Regarding difficulty, I've always heard the Univ of Chicago was a meat grinder, academically speaking. I'd like to try that .. to see for myself how it compares.

If I were writing the Wikipedia intro for the Navy's nuclear power school, think I'd change the word difficult to demanding. No doubt about that.

The word difficult can mean different things to different people, especially where it concerns an academic program.

My best point of comparison (with non-military schools) came during a college semester in which I took Calculus (4-units), Statistics (3-units) & a 7-unit Chemistry class (the hard one, required for both medical & engineering students + lab).

Flexing Nuclear-powered Academic Muscles

I got the highest grade in all 3 classes. (Note » This semester was between jobs, when I wasn't working. Saved hardest classes for between-job periods.) And the professor who taught Statistics taught *two* classes that semester; he told me I got the highest grade in *both* classes.

In the Chemistry class, there was nobody even close to me. Only one other 'A' in the whole class. The mean was down around 55. Class taught by a lady-Ph.D. from India. Kids complained to the adminstrators. (It's a mandatory class for many degree paths.)

She gave the hardest test I'd ever taken. I mean, regarding the amount of brain power necesssary. Each question required serious calculations, often with mutiple parts. Afterwards I drove home and went to bed (at noon). Never done that before.

They claim the human brain uses 20% of your body's daily calorie-burn (energy). In 3 hours, I burned 2 days worth.

My average for that class was 94.5. Like I said, the class mean was around 55. Okay, enough of this shameless academic chest-pounding. And I should note that, in the Navy, Chemistry was my thing (I ran reactor water radio-chemistry daily) .. so I had an advatage over the other kids (as did the Dog at Columbia).

My Ph.D. prof for that class seemed interested in the reactor water radio-chemistry analyses I ran. I was interested in the dot on her forehead, and the interesting dresses (long, flowing, colorful) she wore during religious holidays.

Moreover, I hadn't taken any Math in years, and opted to bypass the Pre-Calculus class (despite everybody warning me not to. Now-a-days, the Pre-Calc class is mandatory.)

Speaking of Calculus, that class was my closest call. A tiny Asian girl sat in the back of the class. Her GPA was always slightly higher than mine .. the *whole* semester.

Every week or two, the prof would pass around a sheet that contained everyone's student ID number with our grades (both current & cumulative) listed alongside. Took me a while to figure out who it was that was ahead of me.

I would wait outside the door during break after an exam and ask her, "So, how'd you do?" She'd just giggle and walk on by. Never heard her say a single word the entire semester. For all I know, she spoke no English.

At the end of the year, the prof posted outside our room the grades for the final exam and our cummultive GPA. I know I didn't ace the final, but saw I scored a perfect 200 points. And I was the only one who scored 200. So I must led the curve, and I saw my cummulative GPA was the highest. I passed the little Aisan girl right at the end. Sweet!

Making the Decision to Go 

You will wish you were dead .. no, just kidding. =) 

Of course, the biggest point of comparison is that .. with the Navy school, you get a paycheck, too .. which is nice. Whereas you have to pay for your (non-military) college education. This can be a deciding factor for those not named Rockerfeller or Getty.

Always had an independent streak .. and wanted to do things myself. If I went to college, woulda had to grovel for tuition money. (Never been a good groveler.) Navy solved my problem. "Adios, folks. Keep your cash. See ya in 6 years. Ciao."

Many (Most?) of my college classes were taken while working 12-hours days. I used the GI Bill (the old one, the good one) to pay tuition. Took 10 years to finish my degree (most of it while working full-time + OT).

Didn't pursue the degree to earn more cash, as the company I worked for was already paying me senior-level engineer wages. No higher pay-grades existed. Rather, it was simply sibling rivalry .. since my brother had graduated from Yale (down the road from where we grew up), then earned his medical degree (from Tufts). 

"Are you the doctor's brother?" people would ask? "No," I'd answer. "The doctor is my brother." =) You know how our culture is enchanted with doctors.

Always been jealous of kids whose parents pay for their college education, who don't have to work while taking classes. Must be nice.

More

Something I'll never forget » hearing the announcement .. "Attention in the engineering spaces: the reactor is critical." (Reactor criticality is a function of neutron population. You control reactor power by controlling its neutron population.)

For more along these lines, here's a Google search preconfigured for the query » navy nuclear power school

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Comments (18)

Rad:

Test comment.

Blog Reader:

I would never find your interesting BLOG without a new automatic browser I downloaded on top of my Firefox, developed by a new start-up www.TilTul.com . It automatically pop-up your Blog (Via Google Blog Search) when I browsed through www.military.com (Click on the BLOG Tab in the Linked lower window). It should be easier for a smart guy like you to figure out how to use those Linked-browser tricks.
If you can't, challenge your brother from the "Harward" Business school to try it out.

Herb Edmonds EM1(SS):

My NPS was at Mare Island in 1963, but never the less you have it described pretty well. It was a great experience.

Rad:

My brother went to Yale, not Harvard Business school.

nukeET:

I went through the navy Nuclear Power program in 1984. I even wrote a book about my experiences. Available at amazon.com here: http://www.amazon.com/2190-Days-My-Navy-Adventure/dp/1598860402/ref=sr_1_1/104-0147431-8547936?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1186082263&sr=8-1

Rad:

Congrats on getting published. I read all the pages Amazon had posted (not the juicy stuff). Tell Amazon to demo the juicy stuff.

I got out about the time you went in .. about the time Rickover left. Always wondered if that made a difference.

I was ELT. The Dog was our emergency welder.

I linked to your book .. maybe it will help sales.

You forgot leap-year days .. at least one, maybe 2. I counted days, too. That's how I kept going. Altho it probably made it seem a lot longer. (Seemed like it took *forever* to get out.)

"Two-digit midget." .. "Tripping over dimes."

NJSteve:

good story. How about posting about your Rickover interview?

Newnuke:

Howdy from Chicago.

First and foremost I must say I greatly enjoy the writing style of your blog. Keep it up!


I just "swore in" on Wednesday to become a Navy nuke. Truth be told I still don't quite understand the purpose of a non-binding contract which can only be signed after 20+ hours of (paper)work. The feeling is similar to if at the end of your first week at a new job your boss were to ask you, "Do you want to work for us?"

Anyways...

22 Years old and signed up for something I know nothing about it. I found your blog while trying to remedy that particular situation. While possibly childish of me my main concern is actually the lifestyle of someone going from power school to prototype. Was it common to go out on the town at least once in a while?

I'm not exactly a "party animal" but I've met some of the modern day nukes and ,to be blunt, they're not exactly the cowboys of the US Military.

-Just another youngster anxious about being part of the nuclear program.

Rad:

I was enlisted. Only officers were interviewed by Rickover.

Regarding a social-life at Prototype .. I can only speak for life in Idaho, for that's where I went, which is where they typically sent those who wanted to end up on the West coast.

When I was there, we worked 12-hours days on a rotation that went like this > 7-on, 1-off > 7-on, 2-off, then 7-on, 5-off. Each 7-day stretch was a different shift (hard to describe in writing). So we got off for basically 5 days (in a row) once a month.

And during that 5 days, we would go fishing, rafting, skiing, hiking, camping, and all kinds of fun outdoors stuff that is available in Idaho.

In Idaho, there is also a 2-hour bus-ride (each way). So every 12-hour day becomes a 16-hour day. They wouldn't let students drive their own cars (to work), cuz too many had fallen asleep at the wheel and killed themselves. Even staff were discouraged from driving their own cars to the work-site.

Idaho is beautiful, but 20-years behind the rest of the country, so "going out on the town" was not very appealing.

My friend Schmidty had a van, which was great for exploring the country. We would wake up in Wyoming, Utah, and everywhere inbetween.

My favorite time was a 5-day ski-trip to Grand Targhee ski resort (in Wyoming), where a few of the local girls were invited to bring along their kids (ages 3-5) .. to a multi-level chalet, right there on the mountain.

The girls cooked something yummy every night (such as a big turkey one night). We brought our own music, and ski'ed every day until dark.

One night, I sat in front of a raging fire with a little 3-year old girl sitting on my lap while I read her stories from her favorite books while it showed outside.

So you become friends with those who have the same work-schedule as you (same days off) .. not necessarily those who were friends at NPS.

NewNuker:

I am about to begin (more like jumpstart from what I understand) my life in NPS here very shortly. I enjoyed reading your entries here and after reading, I was just curious to know if you think NPS and the following career helped open opportunites that might not have existed otherwise? Self gratification for making it through NPS is one thing, but how do you feel it prepared you for other opporunties in the long run? Would you change anything? I'm eager to begin and would like to hear what you could pass down to someone like me.

Rad:

well, the nuclear industry is not thriving, as you probably know, tho it *does* look more appealing, now that the price of oil is so high.

like i said, everything afterwards is comparatively easy.

people tend to be impressed with anyone who has the ability to run a reactor plant, so, in that respect, future chances for employment tend to be enhanced.

but you would still need to educate yourself in the field of your choice. say, for example, you wanted to make movies .. you would still need to learn that.

I found this blog while I was searching for information on the curriculum taught at power school. I went through back in '94 (class 9305) when it was still in Orlando and then went through prototype out in Idaho. Man, that was a great place...too bad they shut it down.

I ended up getting picked up for a commissioning program after I finished prototype. Even to this day, I have never done anything even remotely as close to the difficulty level as completing the nuclear power program. Nothing.

nucwarrant:

I enjoyed reading your entries. I went through NPS when Dr. Wolf got fired. Smart guy but had to realize what would happen if you constantly go against the flow. I did 20. Enlisted/submarines for the first, commissioned as a CWO, did NR and SWO second half. Now working at a commercial BWR. If you miss the pressure of a demanding environment similar to NPS then go for our commercial SRO license.

George:

Steve:

I completed NPS in Orlando in 1978 (class 7709) and went onto A1W in Idaho. Serve on SSN then CGN--Did my Rickover interview when I was selected for NR1 (I completed my undergrad in Math during my 10 years active duty - He highlighted a lit course during my interview). Since departing nothing (this includes two Master's Degrees) compares.

Kevin Peterson:

Just looking around and stumbled onto the site. I was in Orlando NNPS 9006. Good memories, I went to prototype in Goose Creek. It wasn't consolidated at the time. I still keep in touch with a few guys who were on the Abe Lincoln. I'd love to here from you all who went through arond the same time. kjp5604@hotmail.com

Allan :

After a recent trip to SD I found this website. I went to NPS at Mare Island in '62, prototype at A1W, and stayed on as an instructor there until shipped out to serve last year on DLGN25. Never found anything as hard until in the Phd program in physics at U. of Colorado. Lots of good memories of people in the program.

Ron:

Heh, stumbled across this blog while using Radified Guides. I got dropped 17th week from NNPS (Class 7902). Not academic... was holding my own despite both recommended and mandatory study hours being imposed. Came into class 2 hours late one day and was busted in rank, kicked out of school and deemed 'militarily unreliable'. "If you can't be counted upon to follow an order to arrive at class on time, then you cannot be depended upon to follow an order to scram a nuclear reactor in an emergency situation."
--If I'm awake I can.
Three years later I was the work center supervisor for the Catapult and Arresting Gear Electricians on board an aircraft carrier. On the flight deck (where no one can hear you scream) I would occasionally salute the pilots as they were launching and yell "I'm militarily unreliable and that's my catapult you're launching from. Have a nice flight, SIR!" Some personal satisfaction gained from that. Today I work as an electronic controls technician for a major manufacturer. Second shift...lol. Really enjoyed your site and insight.

-=Ron=-

Hey, Rad.

Yep, wouldn't trade the experience for anything; wouldn't do it again for anything. Man, your blog is excellent reading. It really bought back menories and was quite enjoyable. I'm old school but I honestly don't think that matters much when talking about Naval Nuclear Training.

I went to ET"A" school at Treasure Island in 1969 then NPS at Bainbridge, MD followed by proptotype at Schenectady, NY. Spent the next four years on USSN George Washington Carver and a brief stint on USSN Pargo as a RO (reactor operator). Got out and have worked as a consultant fluids engineer for Chevron for 26 years, easiest job in the world!

All you young guys going in, buckle down and have fun. Kick ass and take names. You are making your own way in life and it cannot be taken away! I managed a few beers and trips along the way. Your Nuclear family will be very tight! :-)

Thanks again,
Charlie

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